It is currently Sun 28 Jun 2026 4:11 pm

All times are UTC


Forum rules


Please click here to view the forum rules



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 33 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: A French Proverb
PostPosted: Tue 04 Oct 2011 2:41 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu 01 Sep 2011 9:55 am
Posts: 2114
Location: 91 - France
This is a French proverb that could just as easily be an Irish one
Une bonne conscience est un doux oreiller
There's no pillow as soft as a clear conscience
here's my attempt at it -
ní piliúr chomh bog le coinsias glan
or - Is coinsias glan piliúr bhog


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: A French Proverb
PostPosted: Tue 04 Oct 2011 7:53 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed 07 Sep 2011 5:05 pm
Posts: 422
franc 91 wrote:
Is coinsias glan piliúr bhog

That one’s backwards—it should be is piliúr bog é an consias glan, not the other way around.

I like this phrasing. Feels very Irish.

_________________
Not a native speaker.

Always wait for at least three people to agree on a translation, especially if it’s for something permanent.

My translations are usually GU (Ulster Irish), unless CO (Standard Orthography) is requested.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: A French Proverb
PostPosted: Tue 04 Oct 2011 8:03 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu 15 Sep 2011 12:06 pm
Posts: 2436
Bog means soft (as opposed to hard), mín is soft (as opposed to rough).
bog = mou i bhFraincis
mín = doux

To make it sound more like other Irish proverbs, you may say:

Is mín an piliúr coinsias glan.

or in Ulster: Is mín an babhstar coinsias glan.

_________________
Is fearr Gaeilg na Gaeltaċta ná Gaeilg ar biṫ eile
Agus is í Gaeilg Ġaoṫ Doḃair is binne
:)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: A French Proverb
PostPosted: Tue 04 Oct 2011 8:32 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed 07 Sep 2011 5:05 pm
Posts: 422
Lughaidh wrote:
Bog means soft (as opposed to hard), mín is soft (as opposed to rough).
bog = mou i bhFraincis
mín = doux

To make it sound more like other Irish proverbs, you may say:

Is mín an piliúr coinsias glan.

I suppose that’s a different cultural view on pillows …

I would never consider the ‘soft’ used to describe a pillow as the opposite of ‘rough’ (what pillows are rough? [*]), but the opposite of ‘hard’, since some pillows are actually quite hard—and therefore, quite uncomfortable (for me, anyway).






[*] The answer being obviously traditional Irish straw pillows!

_________________
Not a native speaker.

Always wait for at least three people to agree on a translation, especially if it’s for something permanent.

My translations are usually GU (Ulster Irish), unless CO (Standard Orthography) is requested.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: A French Proverb
PostPosted: Tue 04 Oct 2011 9:20 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun 28 Aug 2011 6:15 pm
Posts: 3594
Location: An Astráil
Lughaidh wrote:
Bog means soft (as opposed to hard), mín is soft (as opposed to rough).
bog = mou i bhFraincis
mín = doux

To make it sound more like other Irish proverbs, you may say:

Is mín an piliúr coinsias glan.

or in Ulster: Is mín an babhstar coinsias glan.

No, bog means "soft" (as opposed to "hard"), mín means "smooth, fine" (as opposed to "coarse").

We can't draw a distinction based on French any more than we should on English. The real test is which words get used together with bog and which with mín in Irish.

Examples with mín:

talamh mín "smooth land"
craiceann mín "smooth skin"
éadach mín "smooth cloth"
teanga mhín "a smooth tongue"
cíor mhín "a fine comb"
créafóg mhín "fine clay"


Examples with bog:

adhmad bog "soft timber"
leathar bog "soft leather"
talamh bog "soft yielding ground
éadach bog "soft cloth"
cathaoir bhog "an easy chair"
craiceann bog mín "soft smooth skin"

Here's a case where if you stick to the original, it could end up being just plain weird in Irish.

Which would the native Irish speakers prefer: piliúr bog? or piliúr mín? Would the latter combination be likely? A wrinkle-free pillow, perhaps? :rolleyes:

I think the following more likely:

Is bog an piliúr coinsias glan.

_________________
Múinteoir Gaeilge - Irish Teacher
My "specialty" is Connemara Irish, particularly Cois Fhairrge dialect, but I can also speak Ulster and Munster Irish with native-level pronunciation.
Is fearr Gaeilge ḃriste ná Béarla cliste, cinnte, aċ i ḃfad níos fearr aríst í Gaeilge ḃinn ḃeo na nGaeltaċtaí.
Gaeilge Chonnacht (GC), go háraid Gaeilge Chois Fhairrge (GCF), Gaeilic Uladh (GU), Gaelainn na Mumhan (GM), agus Gaeilge an Chaighdeáin Oifigiúil (CO).


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: A French Proverb
PostPosted: Wed 05 Oct 2011 8:09 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu 01 Sep 2011 9:55 am
Posts: 2114
Location: 91 - France
Go raibh maith agaibh go léir
- I'm also interested in how the idea of smooth and rough land can be expressed in Irish as it's in the story I'm trying to translate - but that would be for another thread.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: A French Proverb
PostPosted: Wed 05 Oct 2011 10:04 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu 15 Sep 2011 12:06 pm
Posts: 2436
Quote:
No, bog means "soft" (as opposed to "hard"), mín means "smooth, fine" (as opposed to "coarse").


In the French sentence, the pillow is soft, ie. not rough. Soft, like a cat's fur or whatever.
And that is "mín" in Irish, as it is given in De Bhaldraithe's dictionary.

I know bog and mín may mean other things, but here we were talking about what is "doux" in Irish, talking about a pillow, and "doux" is "mín".

_________________
Is fearr Gaeilg na Gaeltaċta ná Gaeilg ar biṫ eile
Agus is í Gaeilg Ġaoṫ Doḃair is binne
:)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: A French Proverb
PostPosted: Wed 05 Oct 2011 10:30 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed 07 Sep 2011 5:05 pm
Posts: 422
Lughaidh wrote:
I know bog and mín may mean other things, but here we were talking about what is "doux" in Irish, talking about a pillow, and "doux" is "mín".

Doux just means ‘pleasant to the senses’, basically—it’s not necessarily the opposite of ‘rough’.

_________________
Not a native speaker.

Always wait for at least three people to agree on a translation, especially if it’s for something permanent.

My translations are usually GU (Ulster Irish), unless CO (Standard Orthography) is requested.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: A French Proverb
PostPosted: Wed 05 Oct 2011 10:38 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun 28 Aug 2011 6:15 pm
Posts: 3594
Location: An Astráil
Image I have a radical (possibly very Irish) solution to this "problem" - use both adjectives:

Is bog mín an piliúr é coinsias glan.

_________________
Múinteoir Gaeilge - Irish Teacher
My "specialty" is Connemara Irish, particularly Cois Fhairrge dialect, but I can also speak Ulster and Munster Irish with native-level pronunciation.
Is fearr Gaeilge ḃriste ná Béarla cliste, cinnte, aċ i ḃfad níos fearr aríst í Gaeilge ḃinn ḃeo na nGaeltaċtaí.
Gaeilge Chonnacht (GC), go háraid Gaeilge Chois Fhairrge (GCF), Gaeilic Uladh (GU), Gaelainn na Mumhan (GM), agus Gaeilge an Chaighdeáin Oifigiúil (CO).


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: A French Proverb
PostPosted: Wed 05 Oct 2011 10:50 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon 29 Aug 2011 4:54 pm
Posts: 3444
Location: Cill Dara
Breandán wrote:
I have a radical (possibly very Irish) solution to this "problem


So do I - sleep directly on the mattress...... and after a night or two, you'll be grateful for any pillow at all!

_________________
Is foghlaimeoir mé. I am a learner. DEFINITELY wait for others to confirm and/or improve.
Beatha teanga í a labhairt.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 33 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4  Next

All times are UTC


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 532 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group